Message Board - Part 1: 2002/04/16 to 2004/09/15
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electorial athorithy in Sweden does not care.
The name logical for a direct democratic party in Sweden is occupied and registered. The name registerd is "Direktdemokraterna". might think. So did I. Well, It would have been great if the ideas of the person were DD. They are not!!!!
When first meeting the person face to face I was introduced to a Pitbull and a person who thougt Mussulini was a really great guy. Imagine my surprise :-) Lucky I like dogs and that I have a high level of tolerance and understanding. If it wasn´t for my lack of time I would have discussed it with him and see if I could change his point of view in a respectfull manner.
The person described his idea of lower taxes to homeowners and showed off his wife in a big fur and friends of his in luxurious villas. Just to let me know what kind of people they were, as he told me. :-)
To bad material things lack great importance to me. Everyone is different and it might appeal to some people. :-)
Later when asking the electorial athorithy in Sweden if it was ok to register misleading names they told me that it was quite allright. I still wonder why it is?
We have now taken another name that is
If you think this is a funny story please visit the man himself or support us by spreading your DD ideals. ;-)
      Martin Gustavsson, martinvaxjo at yahoo . com, Sweden, 2004/9/15

Strange resistance
In Sweden has encountered strange resistance from is a swedish internetsite claiming to have the same ideas, but also making people pay money to a private persons account.
The swedish police and tax athorithy choose not to do anything about it even if we have described the problem to them. It does not seem to be illegal to con people like this in Sweden!
If his intentions were direct democracy over the internet he would simply join us and hand his adress over to our party freely. He has not done this.
Therfore my conclusion is that he in fact is an enemy to the ideas he claim to have or just greedy or both.
If someone has an idea of how to solve the problem, pleas contact me!'
I have run out of ideas.
      Martin Gustavsson, martinvaxj at yahoo . com, Sweden, 2004/9/15

Direct Democracy International
Direct Democracy International
Dear Sir/madam,
We are presently working on a website, which we hope will become an international forum, campaigning for the introduction of Direct Democracy - bringing together various organisations and individuals with similar interests.
Although the site is still under construction, we are building into the site a page for useful website links/bibliographies and related useful information. It should be up and running in about two months and be located at
Would your organisation be interested in allowing us to put your website details onto our site and allowing a reciprocal link to your site. We would simply require your permission, your URL web address, and ideally a short paragraph explaining what you are about. (Max 100 words, although less is can be highly effective!)
Also of help would be references to any books, articles, academic work or courses at Universities and colleges where direct democracy is studied (possibly as part of a wider curriculum) that we can add into our general information section.
Although we are based in London we are hoping to bring various direct democracy groups together, from around the world as there is a growing interest in the subject.
Best wishes,
Tony Adeney, Director, Direct Democracy International
      Tony Adeney, tone . one at, Great Britain, 2004/6/15

The Democracy 2.0 Organization Site is Renovated

After several months of technical and conceptual research, this site has been revised in major ways. The following are enhancements:

  • Revised the content throughout the entire site and generally changed the layout and formatting (for the better, we hope). Especially see the major updates to the FAQ.
  • Created an entry page that clarifies the array of d2 sites, including the upcoming Active Commons Charter.
  • Greatly enhanced the readability and navigation in the Public Library.
  • Made a lot of technical changes to improve site performance on both the server and the client (i.e., your browser).
  • Made the site more spider-friendly, and therefore, much more searchable from Google and other search engines.

Hope everyone enjoys the updates. Please feel free to forward any suggestions or comments to .
      Steve Magruder, director at democracy2 . org, USA, 2004/5/30

Ideas for Development of the Active Commons Charter - United States

Involving the brainshare and participation of many active citizens, a charter named The Active Commons Charter - United States will be developed as open content (possibly in a wiki) for the sake of exploring a wide array of potential and existing successful methods and mechanisms for civic involvement and democratic participation in U.S. states and localities, esp. with respect to utilizing new communications technologies (e.g., Internet).

The charter will also describe how an organization called a democracy service provider or DSP (e.g., Democracy 2.0) can provide part or all of the mechanisms described.

Go to the link provided to get more details and please feel free to offer your suggestions.
      Steve Magruder, director at democracy2 . org, USA, 2004/5/10

New version of D2/DZ now available!

I want to announce Version 1.1.3 of the D2 Discussion Zone. There have been many changes since Version 1.1 was released in January, but I think the most important of those were 1) the ability to spell-check posts, 2) the ability to email topics to friends, and 3) the ability to post "quick replies" to topics. I hope everyone enjoys the changes. Moreover, this latest release should do a lot to enhance the security and stability of the board.

If you should have any issues with or suggestions for the D2/DZ, please don't hesitate to bring them to our attention. You may contact the D2/DZ administrator at Also, the D2/DZ has a 'suggestions & issues' forum that you may post to at any time.

Thanks in advance for your participation in discussing e-democracy and direct democracy in a year I think is full of interesting surprises regarding these topics.

Steve Magruder, Director
Democracy 2.0

      Steve Magruder, director at democracy2 . org, United States, 2004/3/19

The Constitution and 2004 Electoral Platform of Direct Access Democracy Canada
The primary purpose of Direct Access Democracy Canada (DAD Canada) and all its activity is based on the fundamental principles the People as a whole are the only authority in a real democracy to decide on public policy issues and that each eligible member has the right to directly participate every day in the government of her (his) country using democratic practices.
The Vision, Mission and the Principles of Direct Access Democracy Canada can be found on our website:
We would like to introduce you our new Constitution and 2004 Electoral Platform.
Please contact us for more info.
      John Oprea, john . o at, Canada, 2004/3/13

Iraq is a bad place to start
Iraq is a bad place to start direct democracy. You need computer with internet for everyone and a high level of education and most of all you must not have been attaced by anything called democracy lately.
Better then to start in a countries like our own and set a good example.
If we can show other countries that it works they will certainly rid themselves of bad governments and dictators.
      Martin Gustavsson, martinvaxjo at yahoo . com, Sweden, 2004/2/29

D2 Discussion Zone version 1.1 now available!
Greetings everyone.
Today I announce version 1.1 (final) of Democracy 2.0's autonomous discussion board covering practical e-democracy and direct democracy efforts... and much more. This board can be found at . Since the beta release last week, many bugs have been found and have been fixed. Also, several other last-minute updates have been made. Following are highlights of the voluminous changes:
o Members are now called "Citizens"
o Major changes in the board's look
o Now, citizens can set up email notifications for new topics/replies added to specific forums--This was a common request--Check out the "Forum Notifications" link on the top of each board page
o The ratings system was enhanced to:
- add user ranks based on accumulated ratings
- add a requirement of being a citizen 7 days before rating others' posts
- prevent ratings in the "Announcements" and "Test Me" forums
- prevent ratings of posts that are of the announcement or sticky type
- clarify its use
o Topics are now printer-friendly! Just click the new Print button while viewing a topic
o New forums added:
- "Democracy 2.0 Organizational Developments" in the "Democracy 2.0
Specific" category
- "Free for All" in the "Miscellanea" category (where you can place your special announcements, action alerts, event notices, vendor/classified ads, etc.)
o Citizen profile/registration changes:
- Citizens can now delete themselves
- Citizens will now supply their real name (in addition to their username) while registering--this will be displayed in all posts
- Citizens can now select from a list of date formats--before, this date format entry was programmer-oriented
- Citizens can now disable avatar display to help them use the site more effectively if they have low-bandwidth access
- Citizens can now apply their signatures to their posts retroactively
- Visual confirmation is now required to complete registration, so as to block automated registration programs
- Yahoo! Messenger and AOL Instant Messenger buttons (potentially shown for each citizen in posts and profile views) will now display whether the citizen is online or offline
o Searchability enhancements:
- Topics/posts can now be searched by "title only".
- Revised the board code to greatly improve searchability via Google and other search sites
o The 10 most recent topics are now displayed on the board's front page
o Added prominent links to the D2 Public Library and the E-Democracy Meetup to the top of each board page
o Migrated "legacy" messages from the old D2 groups at SmartGroups and Yahoo! Groups to the Announcements forum
o Tons of bug fixes and refinements
I very much hope that everyone likes and enjoys the changes. As always, feel free to provide feedback via the "D2/DZ Suggestions & Issues" forum at .
Here's to a powerful new year for e-democracy and direct democracy! See ya in the D2/DZ forums.
      Steve Magruder, director at democracy2 . org, USA, 2004/1/18

Democracy 2.0 Launches New Discussion Board

phpBB discussion board software has been selected to run the next-generation Democracy 2.0 discussion board, replacing the old SmartGroups version. We're calling it the "D2 Discussion Zone" (or "D2/DZ" for short). We've now got the following forums going, all of which may be of great interest to the direct democracy movement:

  • Direct Democracy in Practice
  • The Foundations of Effective Direct Democracy
  • The Foibles of American Democracy
  • The Promise & Problems of High-tech Utilization for Participation Mechanisms

Please feel free to drop by anytime and participate in what should be some very fascinating discussions.
      Steve Magruder, director at democracy2 . org, USA, 2003/9/26

Talk "E-democracy" Over Coffee

Steven Clift of Democracies Online Newswire (DO-WIRE) fame recently got to add a topic for "e-democracy". Meetup is a weblication that provides for individuals from around the world to organize meetups at local establishments (such as coffee shops) to discuss topics of interest. I am encouraged that this could become a great way to expand discussion of finding practical ways to expand democracy's reach via e-democracy tools and techniques. At the very least, these meetups could plant some "e-democracy seeds" in some locales where nothing much was growing before. These informal meetings could very well turn into something formal in many areas.

Whaddya say? Let's get wired over our favorite subject. ☺

Go here to join the E-democracy Meetup.
      Steve Magruder, director at democracy2 . org, All Countries, 2003/9/26

E-democracy goes mainstream

On September 2, the CBC radio aired a program on e-democracy (see Part 2, about one third down the page; you can listen to it here) in connection with the first municipal election in Canada, in Markham, Ontario, in which the voters have the option to vote on the Internet. In this piece also Stephen Coleman, the Professor of e-democracy at University of Oxford and Steven Clift of Minnesota E-Democracy were interviewed. The emphasis was still mainly on the top-down approach (Internet as a means to improve top-down delivered governemnt services), except for the Stephen Clift mentioning direct democracy elements.
At least one member of the Canadian parliment, Carolyn Bennett, is also exploring the use of e-democracy. You can view her presentation on this subject at a Commonwealth meeting last June: Part 1 and Part 2.
Interesting are her slides 9 and 10 in Part1 and 11 in Part 2, showing that general public is interested in having input in decision making. Note in slide 9 the big difference in what the elites and the general public want (from opinion surveys).
In slide 17 and 18 (part 1) she quotes Prof. Coleman: "People don’t want to govern they want to be heard",
and "This (e-democracy) is NOT about e-government; This is NOT about direct democracy".
But if they manage to introduce and perfect technology that could be used to introduce direct democracy, it would be a big step forward!
      M. Kolar, dd at mkolar . org, Canada, 2003/9/3

The Dream - new book by George Sagi
THE DREAM describes a 21st Century struggle to prevent the destruction of civilization, and the creation of a global democracy. ....
More at the above URL.
The Dream will soon be available in major bookstores. It can already be ordered from Booksurge LLB/Imprint. Read a sample here.
      dd at mkolar . org, Canada, 2003/8/24

Legalizing U. S. Democracy
The most plausible effort yet, The National Initiative for Democracy ( ), is mounting a most serious movement to pass both a "Democracy Act" and a "Democracy Amendment" to the US Constitution. It will create a "US People's Legislature" to co-govern with Congress.

I've been assured by Senator Mike Gravel, the founder, that once the system is established in America, they'll work toward enfranchising the rest peoples of the world.

Click the link and go vote for the Initiative now, (US Citizens Only).

      Al Smith, info at majorityvoice . com, USA, 2003/7/2

Votable forums for every issue doesn't just discuss democracy. It is the only current example of an actual system of the inevitable literal ditital Democracy of humankind's future.
Our "votable" Forum System is a free, non-partisan, local/global, member-initiated, issue-specific, democratic, perpetual-town-hall-meeting capable of enabling all the diverse groups of Humanity to define, proclaim and achieve their common goals.
All it needs is your participation
      Al Smith, info at majorityvoice . com, All, 2003/7/2

Promoting E-democracy in Iraq
If the US is genuine about creating democracy in Iraq, let's all join in suggesting that it be E-democracy. This could be a good place to test out E-democracy theories. All E-industries could join in the effort (reviving their lagging businesses, along with major industries, foundations, philanthropists, etc. It would be an excellent investment in a sane future. It could then begin the process of converting all dictatorships and oligarchies to E-democracy. This should pave the way for peace and sustainability. Let's try to make the "war for peace" in Iraq the last - ever.
      John Suhr, ElecCity at aol . com, USA, 2003/4/11

Where's the Beef?
I have a simple plan to bring DD to the masses. Part One, enact Democracy Amendment in the USA. Part Two, invite everybody in. The first part is the most difficult I believe. Since 3rd Parties tend to negate themselves and their message in a two party system I propose working WITHIN the two party system to affect change. The plan is simple. A new political party (I like "Common Sense Party") is needed which will support whichever candidate in either of the two major parties is MOST agreeable to DD. This is how to get things done within a two party system. The one qualifying factor for any candidate regardless of their Party is their support for DD. This Party will focus solely on DD and rate every candidate in every election according to their DD affinity. Think of it as akin to how the Pro-Lifers use abortion as a litmus test for their elections. The reason why and how religios fundfamentalists (pro-lifers, et al) have taken over the system contrary to common sense is that they know how to USE THE SYSTEM. Anybody else have a plan? Personally, I don't think running candidates on a separate 3rd party platform is going to work. At Least not initially. I am not opposed to running on a 3rd party but let's face it the system is stacked against third parties. For those DDers living in a more conducive environment such as parliamentary systems then a 3rd party may make more sense.
      John, bakejohnj at hotmail . com, USA, 2003/4/11

The European Constituent Process. The Spanish Perspective

You can find at
      info1 at demopunk . net, 2003/3/29

The European Constituent Process. The Spanish Perspective

Last Friday was delivered before IRI-Europe the report "The European Constituent Process. The Spanish Perspective". The report was submitted during Forum "European Referendum Challengue", Barcelona 2003.
      Demopunk Net, info1 at demopunk . net, Spain, 2003/3/29

Foriegn Policy Dialogue in Canada

This online citizen engagement project with the Department of Foreign Affairs provides an opportunity for Canadians to contribute to Canada's Foreign Policy.
      Dhirender Nirwani, weaver at webtapestry . org, Canada, 2003/3/1

re: Virtual Democracy

Michael -- I hope you will go to my web site for the Direct Democracy League and read especially my intro essay, "State Of The Republic". It's about 1400 words long and shouldn't take too much of your time. It's about defining the terms of governance so that we can minimize the semantical disagreements. It's about governance from the people's point of view, too, as well as many of the problems that we face. I'll watch this message board for any further comments of yours. --Stephen
      Stephen Neitzke, stephen at ddleague-usa . net, USA, 2003/1/22

Virtual Democracy

In 1992 Ross Perot entered the race of the Presidency. One of his proposals was the use of a Virtual Democracy through the use of the Internet. The type reasoning was typical for the Information age. Under his theory and others like him the Internet would be used to bring ideas together. For example chat rooms may be given different political topics such as Abortion, the Environment, Agriculture, etc. In each technological age there have always been individuals that attempt to incorporate that specific technology into their system of government in the same way mass production marked the beginning of Fascism, which the Industrial Revolution marked the beginning of Communism. Virtual Democracy has three inherent problems. First there are individuals with in our society who would be excluded from this government just because they have no knowledge of the technology, nor do they care to know. Second this form of government carries many of the same problems that existed in the Democracies of ancient Greece. In Ancient Greece the entire town got together on average once a week, but could happen as often as every day. This process from the onset was a very inefficient from a time perceptive. In the beginning individuals attended all the meetings, but soon the responsibilities of day to day life soon took over. Also as there was no Constitution if you did not show up to these meetings the whole style and form of government could go from the extreme right to the extreme left in a day depending on who was present. The situation got even worse as shy individuals, who may have had the best solution to the problem at hand often felt a great deal of intimidation speaking before the crowd. Also as matters of politics often pull over emotions the most loud hard head individuals ended up controlling the debate. The Third and final problem was that individuals would get wrapped up in the heat of the moment and let there emotions guide their political actions. Political actions are best when not done during the heat of the moment, but rather should come about after long hours of careful consideration and thought. This lawlessness during the meetings is often the reasons most individuals acquaint Democracy with Anarchy. Virtual Democracy carries all these same traits. First individuals are unable to spend their lifetime online. It is not only inefficient for the average individual, but it also limits participation to those who are logged in during that time, because of this Virtual Democracy does not fully represent the individual. Also often individuals entering a chat room if not apart of the usual crowd are ignored. And finally these laws also, because they are not presented after completion are still the subject of the heat of the moment discussions lacking long term thought and reason.
      Michael Stansfield, mstansfield at infographicsystems . com, United States of America, 2003/1/22

Stick to the facts Maam

Let's talk facts. I hate the word Direct Democracy. What we are really looking for is Democracy. Let's call Representative Democracy what is really is a Republic. Democracy can only really exist when individuals have direct control over there tax rates and where their money is spent. Also realistly just the existance of a congressional body will allow the rule of the few to take away what little representation we have even if a Democracy is formed. The internet is a good forum for general purposes, but is unable to serve the whole population. This is not to say that I believe direct democracy to be impossible just through a different venue. Also any form of government that voids local culture, customs and government to the super power of a national government is neither a Democracy nor democratic in nature. All I'm saying is that if we are going to do this we better damn well get it right before we push a bad system on a all too willing population. So where can we all put our proposals on the table, beat the crap out of them, and come up with something pure and good. I know I have points to add to debate, let's see what you got. If I am in the wrong place tell me where I should go.
      Michael Stansfield, mstansfield at infographicsystems . com, United States of America, 2003/1/21

comments on direct democracy

I work for a branch of the government, and I must say after almost 24 years there, I can think of no better argument for total government reform than the fact that major non-democratic forces (e.g. religion and corporatism) seem to be able to wield more power to run the country's country-runners than does the vox populi. The interplay between mass-media's corporately-inspired push for ratings and these other forces is also distressing. If anyone has good ideas and ways to implement them powerfully, I applaud your efforts.
Christian Zen Discordian, signing off.
      Bimp, bimp at toad . net, USA, 2002/9/18

Legal basis of national referendums in Britain

Dear Mirek and friends,
There's a new page at the Integral Studies website. It's quite heavy reading - meant for enthusiasts of democracy!
THE LEGAL BASIS FOR NATIONAL REFERENDUMS IN BRITAIN Compendium of contributions to an online discussion in the British university forums Law-public and Public-administration-and-management. There are some informative letters, international comparisons and literature references. Questions arise from this discussion such as: If a referendum on whether to join "Euroland" is held, will the result be binding or just advisory? What are the chances to introduce legally regulated elements of direct democracy, such as citizens' initiative and referendum, in Great Britain and Northern Ireland?
You can find the compendium via
Cheers, Michael
      Michael Macpherson, mm at iniref . org, Britain & Germany, 2002/9/6

Post communists in Hungary today

Yesterday I heared through Hungarian medium, that the Minister of Foreign Affairs of Brusseles announced that he supports Mr Medgyessy, our PM understanding him. I don't think that anybody needs such a kind of intervention in our affairs. Do you really think to give a hand for a post communist lier, who kept in secret one dark part of his life? There was a sceleton in the cupboard. I as a Hungarian can never trust such kind of a politician. You are too far from Hungarian history and life and unable to realize what really happens in our country even today. I charge you not to support Mr D209 against Hungarians. I hope that this was nothing but an announcement to focus on diplomatic relations and not a support of post communism.
Kind regads, Marta Gagrami, Phd. biologist internet journalist
      Marta Garami, garamim at axelero . hu, Hungary, 2002/6/30

Free domains for non-profit organizations provides free domain registration for non-profit organizations, more or less world-wide, not only for the EU countries. They even have US and Canadian subdomains, and
      dd at mkolar . org, 2002/6/18

Join the Shadow Government! You are invited to become part of our experiment in Direct Democracy. We are in the initial phase of working out the protocols and mechanisms. We would be grateful to have your input.
Sincerely, Wat Tyler
      Wat Tyler, WatsRevenge at hotmail . com, USA, 2002/6/6

RE: Can you help me?

Dear A.:
You may be missing the point: By its definition, DD cannot be installed somewhere from the outside with the help of external money. If there is enough people in your community who support DD, you do not need any outside help to start it. Do it, and it would be a great example for others. The purpose of the international community of DD advocates, as I understand it, is to educate people about DD and its advantages, and to create the theoretical foundations od DD.
      Mirek Kolar, DD at mkolar . org, 2002/5/25

Can you help me?

Listen please, I can bring direct democracy !anywhere, starting for example in Poland, my community of Kamien Pomorski, when I win there local elections. I can help you bring direct democracy, but everything needs finances - for Internet access, etc... I was studying law - and I bring direct democracy because of practical and legal reasons. I am 100% honest. So what I can expect actually from you?
      A, demokrata at o2 . pl, Poland, 2002/5/22


Although not alone as a harbinger of change in the millennia ahead, DEMOCRATHONS ( are politically/socially well-posited to advance human enlightenment in tandem with the human predilection for empathy and compassion. The democrathon process utilizes the Initiative and Referendum (Direct Democracy) and serves additionally as an effective fundraising-format. Disbursement of surplus monies generated by a DEMOCRATHON successful at the polls (targeting worthy projects) is effected as predetermined by organizers.
      Robert E. Cobb, forelaws at yahoo . com, USA, 2002/4/18

The ADL Perspective

- Here is a web page of two articles out of the five that will interest DD advocates. One is about revising the 1040 tax forms so that tax payers can decide what gov't programs they want their tax money to go to and the other is about useing the internet to vote on proposed legislation that Congress comes up with. Worth while reading may even lay out a good blue print for DD.
      ADALEL, ADALEL at hotmail . com, USA, 2002/4/16


Please, use this Message Board for any announcements, suggestions or comments concerning improvement of democracy, promotion of Direct Democracy.
      Webmaster, DD at mkolar . org, 2002/3/18